Jason Hamrock: Well, today, I’m talking with Jeremy Hardwick. Jeremy is the communications director at Compass Christian Church in Texas. They’ve got a multi-campus facility in the Dallas Fort Worth area. Compass does some amazing, amazing things. And you’re going to get to hear from Jeremy on what they’re doing now to engage their congregation now that they are back to in person. And so enjoy the conversation with Jeremy.
Jason Hamrock: Hey, Jeremy, thanks for being here today.
Jeremy Hardwick: Hey, Jason, thanks for inviting me.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah. Yeah. So Compass is a fast growing church. You guys are in multiple campuses. How many campuses do you have now?
Jeremy Hardwick: So we have four physical locations, and then our online, our online presence. We actually have an online campus that we designate as a campus. So we need to [inaudible] campus pastor for that.
Jason Hamrock: When did you guys spin that up?
Jeremy Hardwick: A couple of years ago. We started, we started doing online back in 2013. I guess, 2013, basically out of necessity. We had an ice storm that came through and we needed to, we didn’t want to allow people to come to just for safety reasons or whatever, we had to close the doors for that weekend. So we needed to figure out a way that we could still do church for that weekend. So we kind of pushed go on it, and just started, we didn’t really have all the kinks worked out and everything. But we just then kind of steadily growing and going from then.
Jason Hamrock: So what all does the online campus pastor, how is that structured, other than we can worship? What else did they do?
Jeremy Hardwick: So, they actually have a team, so they actually work on multiple things, on connecting with people all over. So we have people that watch from basically all over, all over the United States, and even in other parts of the country. So, one of our our main purposes for those that, for those during COVID, you probably realize that online presence has become very popular. A lot of times before COVID people are using it as a front door to the church, to kind of experience what your church would be like. So that was kind of a front door for us, a lot of people would watch and would learn who we are. What was their style of worship? What was the the pastor like? What was this teaching like? How did they do that kind of stuff? So that was kind of the initial start.
Jeremy Hardwick: We started using some different tools, like what Life Church uses with their online church online platform. Done some stuff, custom stuff, ourselves in the past using the chat features and stuff, and had volunteers who are chat hosts, that would connect with people and actually would follow up with people throughout the week. And so that’s kind of grown. even more so from just the church on that platform, even grown to having hosts on Facebook Live and YouTube Live and doing that same thing, connecting with people and being able to connect with them outside of just that weekend experience. So we have a lot of follow up that are host and our online campus pastor will do follow up with people outside of the weekend experience even, so.
Jason Hamrock: So it sounds like you guys are not only just trying to do church, but actually start discipling people from the moment they connect.
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely. Yeah. We’ve, I don’t know if we’ve been successful, I would say we’ve been successful. But we’re trying to figure out ways, what is it look like to do community groups where people can connect with each other in an online forum, and not during just this season of COVID of people doing online, just meeting with their community group through Zoom. But what does it look like with people across the country? How how can they connect with people if they’re not connected with the local church, or they don’t have a church in there in their area, or a church that is thriving and growing that they’re a part of? How can we help them with our mission? How can we navigate them to God? How can we continue to pour into them and engage them into the mission?
Jason Hamrock: So are you are you seeing success in that?
Jeremy Hardwick: I don’t know. I don’t know if I would have a definitive yes saying success, I think we still needed to define what success looks like for us in that field. I know we’ve had people that have signed up for or those groups. But as far as like what that looks like long term, I think we’re still real, real new, real in the early stages of what that is going to look like from a long term perspective.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, talking to a lot of churches around the country, it seems like every churches at that stage. That it’s hard to determine what does success look like, and do we want to pursue this. But what’s cool from my perspective is that because of COVID, it is causing the church to think and try these new strategies to meet and reach people, and start to disciple them in leading up to a relationship with Jesus. And to me, that’s a good thing, right? You know, you’re not going to hit a home run from the first at bat. It might be a bunch of strikeouts before you even hit the ball, but at least you’re trying.
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely. Yep. Yeah, I think that’s what’s been kind of fun this time. It’s given us an opportunity just to try things and see if it works, and if it doesn’t, that’s okay, we can shift and pivot and try something else. One thing, it’s also been kind of cool, just from our from our leadership perspective, just we’ve got a lot of…They basically they’ve allowed us to be able to take those risk and have given us the resources that we need to be able to kind of step into those areas and see what does that look like? How can we continue to reach people outside of our walls and connect them, connect them with Christ?
Jason Hamrock: That’s pretty cool, so you guys are, you’re back to do an in-person.
Jeremy Hardwick: We started, so we started in-person gatherings at the end of May, went for a couple of weeks to take a hiatus because things kind of spiked back up in the Dallas Fort Worth area. So, had to take a hiatus and then we started back again about four weeks ago, so mid-August we started back again. It’s been, it’s been slow going. I’d say, not everybody is, obviously not everybody’s coming back just yet. So we’re trying to figure out what that looks like moving forward. We just opened up our kids environments for kids and students just a couple of weeks ago. So when we started back in August, we didn’t start back with, like, everything full on. So kind of doing some of those in phases and everything.
Jason Hamrock: So when you think about the idea of getting people to come back, I think churches are starting to strategize around that. So I’d love to hear from you on, have you guys thought through, how are we going to get our people, our people that call Compass our home church, how are we going to get them back together? And is it safe to do that even, you know, or is there a timeline that we’re trying to follow? Have you guys given thought to what that looks like?
Jeremy Hardwick: So we start having conversations about that yesterday, actually, with our leadership team. Just trying to wade through what that looks like. I would say right now, if you ask some of our pastors have asked some of our community group leaders and some of our core leaders kind of where they where they sit on the fence or whatever, as far as feeling comfortable to come back in person or if they’re not ready yet kind of thing. So from what we’re hearing so far, it’s kind of a 50/50 mix. Some of them are, yes, let’s do it. kind of gung ho kind of thing. But then you have those that are still not ready, but at the same time, it’s hard. And many people can probably attest to this, especially if you follow a lot of your members on social media, if you see them out and doing things in the public, they’re taking pictures or selfies with their friends at the gym, or at a concert, or whatever. They’re doing something where there are around other people, but they still don’t feel comfortable to come back to the church. That’s like one of those things that we’re trying to like. okay, what is it, where is the disconnect that we’re having here, like what is it? One of the questions is, did we make the online experience too good and push that so hard that people just get comfortable? I mean, all of us are creatures of habit. Have we made that so good of an experience that they’re just, they’re okay with staying that way. I think that’s a conversation we’re trying to figure out, how can we get people to get out of that comfort zone, to get uncomfortable? The online campus, and doing stuff online is great, I have no issues with doing any of that. But sometimes people got to, you’ve got to get them…For them to sit at home and just watch it and not engage, that’s not what we want them to do. If they’re a part of our campus, and they’re a part of the online campus somewhere else in the United States or whatever, they’re not connected, that’s one thing. Or if they’re on vacation or sick, that kind of stuff. But if they’re, how can we get them to continually engage with with the body of Christ with each other, and just to grow in their faith. So that’s definitely something we’re trying to figure out. What does that look like for us moving forward? What is our language? Do we need to change some of our language on how we communicate that to them?
Jason Hamrock: So, yeah, it’ll be interesting to see what you guys come up with, and no doubt every church is having that same kind of conversation. I know we are when we’re talking to churches, and I think you said it perfectly. It’s we create such a great online experience that, hey, this is kind of fun. I can go roll out of bed in my pajamas, grab the kids, watch church, go on with my day. And which is which is fine and good, but we understand that community needs to happen in person. And I don’t think people are going to wander their way back to coming in person for the time being, some will. Right? But I think a church, like you guys should be intentional about, you know, creating not only opportunities for people to come back to you, like let’s do a fun day where we invite everybody back and we’re all outside and that kind of thing. But actually promoting it, and being intentional about getting in front of their faces. I think we’ve got to break those, we call them a good habit because they’re watching church, so that’s a good habit. But we want them to be in person at church, so we’ve got to kind of reshape that habit, right?
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah.
Jason Hamrock: So this has been obviously a challenge for you as a communication director and a leader. What have you, what have you done that has worked and hasn’t worked, when it comes to doing your job?`
Jeremy Hardwick: Oh, goodness. I think one thing, just in any role within the church, especially in this season, you’ve got to be flexible and adaptable. If it’s hard for you to change, you have to think you’re in the wrong business. Because one, Jesus changed people. So if you’re not just ready to change just what’s going on within our culture, to be able to adapt, to be able to connect with people where they’re at. If you’re not willing to change, that’s going to be going to be real tough for you to get people to to even listen. So I think being being adaptable and being willing to change is is key. Some of the things that I think I would say that not to do, would be don’t get your feelings hurt, because I think there’s so many moving parts. When all this first happened, I feel like we were kind of in the wild wild west. Like everybody is just trying to figure out what what can we do to make stuff happen, and I think sometimes decisions are made, or we need to shift things around. And it has nothing to do with people like trying to attack somebody specific role or anything like that, I think sometimes we’ve just got to make changes and adapt, like I said. So sometimes you’ve just got to be, you’ve got to be a team player and kind of step in and fill the gap a lot of times, where is needed. So a lot of times, say there’s a ministry that you can only really do that ministry in person. So what does that, if that was your role of doing something that your ministry has to happen with people there, what can you do now to help other areas of the church succeed? And even ultimately, I mean, that’s not going to just help that ministry, it’s going to help the church overall, and would help your ministry grow when you get back to that point of being back in person. So I think just being able to, don’t don’t be scared of feeling like somebody is going to step in and take your role, just be adaptable and be a team player.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, and be willing to try things knowing that we’re probably going to fail, but that’s what’s going to cause us to get better and find something that actually works really well. And I think that’s kind of, that’s what we’re called to do.
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely. Yeah.
Jason Hamrock: So are there, to kind of put you on the spot, are there any sacred cows that Compass was doing in the past, but because of COVID and this kind of shut down and now you’re back open, that you’re not bringing with you? Old baggage that you’re leaving in the past? Like, yeah, we were doing this ministry, or we were doing that event, or that program, or we were saying this or that, and now’s a good opportunity to kind of kill that because we can.
Jeremy Hardwick: I think we’re looking at what some of those opportunities are, and obviously some of the events we’ve had to cancel just because of the season. But I think what we’re evaluating also and moving forward is, is that something that we need to continue doing? Or is there a way that we can still accomplish that same mission but in a different format? So, one of the things that we’ve kind of we thought real, real, real hard and prayed about this for quite a while, is we’ve done this meal marathon where we pack about half a million meals every year to send meals down to kids in Haiti. And so, we’re getting to that point of the year, which we’ve already decided that we’re going to do it, like what does that look like? Because in the past it was an all day thing, get as many people in as we can, about 2000 people from the community and from our church that are coming in. Like we’d have people from all over the community, like their groups, like football teams, like Boy Scouts, all kinds of different groups, other churches would come, we’d have Muslim churches that would come and be a part of this. And they would just basically all day Saturday, we would pack meals from 8:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m., and we’d be able to pack five hundred thousand meals to send in a container down to down to Haiti. So think about, okay, what is that look like this year? Obviously we can’t do, we can’t do something like that in that same capacity or that same format. So our outreach team has kind of thought through kind of a whole brand new way for us to be able to still do something like that. And the reason why we move forward with doing this is because we actually, we could easily…And this may help answer what are some ways that we’re trying to engage people back into being in person. We could easily just send money to the mission and get people to, and send the meals down to Haiti. We have those funds available to be able to where we could just do that, and just send them down, and that’s that. But one of the things that we realized here in the past, doing the meal marathon, is getting people engaged in doing something like that, and the camaraderie of being around other people. Doing kind of like that team environment, where they’re packing meals, and just the bigger mission of them actually doing something as a part of it has brought a lot of… I don’t know what their exact word is, but just growth for people just in their, and how they serve. And knowing that they can do little things like that to be able to to serve others around the world. So we started looking at what does that..How can we do something like that? Where they can still have not the same experience, but be able to have a similar experience that still has the same impact kind of thing. So instead of having it one day at one location, we’ve actually decided kind of the plan that we’re doing now is we have it, we’re actually doing it two of our campuses now. So two of our campuses spread out over seven days, so in multiple shifts where people can be socially distanced and spread out. Obviously, we will have certain requirements. people wearing masks and stuff like that just to meet all those social distance protocols and everything with COVID protocol.
Jeremy Hardwick: But we’re excited because we’re hoping this will help kind of stir people, kind of get them up off the couch and back into serving. And kind of realize, okay, it’s okay to be around people and just be cautious and everything. And obviously, if you’re immuno-deficient or whatever, obviously that’s not right for you. But for those of you that are healthy and capable, like, come on, let’s go, let’s do this kind of thing. Like this is an opportunity that we can still move the mission forward, just because a lot of things have shut down does not mean that the mission has stopped at all. We need to continue moving forward.
Jason Hamrock: So, yeah, you know, it’s almost, you’re practicing community again. That’s what comes to my mind when you said that, it’s we’ve gotten so comfortable. We’re working from home, or we’re doing we’re just kind of isolated, and we’ve fallen out of the idea of surrounding ourselves with community. Which we understand from a biblical perspective, that’s what God intended, to do life with one and other. And to serve others, to be the hands and feet of Jesus, and do it because we love him. And so I think this is a great example of a church, you guys, giving your people, and others in the community the opportunity to practice community again in a safe environment. Safe[inaudible] all that. But I think churches have to be, I think this is the next season is we’ve got to be really intentional about causing our people to get engaged again. And if you don’t offer those kind of outlets, to your point, you’re not going to get that result. And so, and you can’t do it the way you used to do it would get that, but what a great way just to serve tons of kids in another country that desperately needs it, and to serve our own people who desperately need to serve. You know, that’s kind of a cool, that’s a cool win. And something that every church should figure out how to do. And I know it’s a lot more work.
Jeremy Hardwick: Oh, yes. It takes a lot more work. The easy route would be just to write the check and send the money.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, and the same result would happen, kids would get fed. But the process of getting there, you just took away huge opportunities for your own people, and people in the community to practice community together.
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely.
Jason Hamrock: So, that’s that’s pretty cool. Are you guys, are you changing up the way that you’re doing church, your services on the weekend? Or are those are pretty much the same thing? You just opened up kids, is it still the same type of vibe, or is it something unique and different?
Jeremy Hardwick: So I would say one thing that’s different, we have shortened our services for sure. So I would say on average, our services normally would be about 65 to 70 minutes, we’ve shortened that down to probably about 55 minutes now. So part of that is to allow the time in between in between services for people to have enough time to feel comfortable getting out. While the next wave of people come in. So, that’s probably been one big thing that we’ve done with it. We are even, we were really good at this at our Colleyville location, which is our broadcast location for our online campus.
Jeremy Hardwick: So for those that don’t know very much about Compass, the way the way our multisite structure is set up is we have a we have a live communicator. Each campus has a campus pastor that is the primary communicator at each campus, so we don’t have one primary speaker that we feed out to all of our campuses. All of our campuses have one primary communicator that they’re communicating the same message, same big idea, just kind of their own, their own personality flair of how they communicate. But one difference I would say that we’ve done for those campuses that we’re used to broadcasting to Facebook and YouTube normally, is we’ve been a lot more intentional in how we communicate. Like communicating not only to the room, but also making sure we’re connecting with those that are with us online also. So we will be very specific of saying, hey, we want to welcome Joe and Sue, who are joining us on Facebook today, or Sally that’s watching in North Carolina on YouTube, we want to welcome you guys. So there’s a way for not only that, we can connect with those people that are watching with us online, but it helps the people in the room also know, hey, this is bigger than just me sitting right here, just the group of people that are sitting here. There’s a lot, there’s other people that are here, not just in the room, but they’re engaged with what’s going on here as well. So doing that from the host perspective, and even our pastors connecting. So even from when they’re going through their messages, asking people to write something, to write something in the chat or in the comments or something, when he asks a question kind of thing. You know, so making it intentional when they’re communicating, like engaging them to be a part of what’s going on with those that are in the room as well.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, that’s a really good thought process because you really dissolve the four walls. Because yes, you can physically see people, but there’s so many people through that camera on the other end of that digital line, if you will, that’s actually, they’re are people and they’re watching. And so you have to address those people, almost more than the people in the room. Right. And it’s sounds like you guys got it covered. That’s a that’s a good thought to make sure that you do that as a church, right, don’t forget about them.
Jason Hamrock: So when you guys are doing your sermon series planning, have you…with all the. Here we are in September 2020, we’ve got COVID that’s been, that’s just kind of turned everything upside down and 180. We’ve got an election happening in just a couple months. We’ve got racial issues. We’ve got unemployment. We’ve got all this stuff, you know, all these things happen in our country. Certainly Dallas Fort Worth area isn’t immune to all this stuff, it’s…
Jeremy Hardwick: You’re right.
Jason Hamrock: Affected as well. Do you guys when you think about what you’re preaching on your sermon series, are you kind of, is that something you guys have thought through? Like we really want to address these issues or things like that?
Jeremy Hardwick: Absolutely. So actually, one of the things that we did trying to think when in the process, it may have been in the May timeframe. Kind of about two or three months into this, we did a series from the Book of Philippians that we called, Anxious for Nothing. So we talked about anxiety and depression, and what does that look like? And it’s not okay to kind of stay in that realm, but we understand, like, there’s a lot of things that can cause anxiety and depression and how can we walk through that? And how can we, how can we as a church help you? Just because we may not be meeting together, there’s still ways that we can help care for you and and help provide resources for you during that time. So that’s one way specifically addressing just the anxiety, because that was obviously a heightened thing. I mean, it’s always been there. it’s just been amplified over these last few months.
Jeremy Hardwick: And we’re looking at different ways also, from a marriage perspective, just there’s a lot of, we are hearing a lot of marriages, about a lot of couples in our church that are struggling with their marriages, with what’s going on. Whether they’re just home together more, and they don’t know how to communicate, or just driving each other crazy. How can how can we help them? How can we help them, or give them the resources that they need to have their marriage focused on God? And how can they work together to love each other, and not be fighting with each other, and fight for each other? So that was a big, that was a big thing.
Jeremy Hardwick: A couple of weeks ago, we actually did a big series called… Kind of based off of what Jeff Henderson did with for Gwinnett, whenever he was at Gwinnett church in Atlanta. We kind of, a lot of churches have kind of jumped on that bandwagon of kind of doing a for their city kind of campaign. So we kicked off a, just a two week series, called For DFW. So we kind of, kind of grabbed that domain and hashtag, and try to take it over as much as we can. So just letting people know that the church is for them, letting the businesses, the people in our communities, just letting them know that we are a church that is for them. Basically, the concept is for far too long, the church has been known about what it’s against, we want to be known what we are for. So that’s kind of the message that we, that we’ve been communicating. We had shirts that we printed up, and that was one way we’re trying to get people back in also, is to come get a shirt. So we would, we gave out a bunch of shirts for that, some of them we wound up mailing or people would come up after service. We kind had the drive through for those that didn’t want to, or weren’t able to be there. We had opportunities for them to still pick up a shirt. But we kind of challenged all of our people to begin just showing our community, the community that they’re in, that we are for them. So we’ve set up a separate website, kind of a challenge for them, like a ten day challenge that we gave them different ideas that they could do. Things like go to one of your favorite local restaurants and take a picture and write up a thing, what you love about them, and hashtag for DFW on there. And so kind of just a different little ideas like that, talk about a nonprofit that you love and what’s some of the amazing things that are doing. Or talk about somebody in our community, whether it’s a friend, or a neighbor, or somebody, that they’re doing something good. How can you share the good that’s happening in our community and kind of just, kind of turn up the the good that’s happening.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, and that doesn’t cost anything other than the shirts you gave away, which is pretty cool. It’s a free T-shirt, and you can send me one. But, you know, that stuff is just, you guys are forward thinking. You know, and just going what can we do to engage community and let people know we care, let people know the church is open for business. You know, we never went anywhere, we love people and this is a way where you could serve them. That stuff is really smart thinking, because it carries so much further than you’ll ever know on digital tools. It’ll go so much further on these platforms, and that’s pretty cool.
Jeremy Hardwick: Yeah, we’re kind of excited to see where that’ll, where that’ll take us. I know we’re just kind of in the early stages of from that, just from a social perspective. That we’re even, we have a couple of billboards here in the area, close to our our campuses. And we actually wound up just putting on the billboard hashtag for DFW on the billboard. So hoping that it kind of drives like, what is that? Let me go search and see what that is, and kind of learn more about it. So people can kind of see some of the things that we’re doing, just as a church, that we’re a church for our community.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, I love it. I love it. Well, you guys are doing some amazing stuff, Jeremy, keep it up.
Jeremy Hardwick: All right, all right.
Jason Hamrock: I appreciate your time. Thanks for, you know, first of all, thanks for letting us partner with you. We get to do a lot with Compass, and you guys are great. You guys are the kind of church that we just we love to work with because you guys are always thinking about how to reach people that are far from God. And loving on people that, like in Haiti, you just have your mind set on that. And it’s a lot of fun to be able to serve you guys.
Jeremy Hardwick: It’s been a lot of fun working with you guys. It’s been a huge help. You guys have been a huge help for us, being able to help with our digital presence, and just running Facebook ads, and SEO, and all kinds of different stuff. All that, yeah, it’s been a huge help for us as well. So, we love working with you guys.
Jason Hamrock: Yeah, thanks, man. Well, good to talk. I appreciate your time, and we’ll talk to you soon.
Jeremy Hardwick: Sounds great. Thanks, Jason.
Jason Hamrock: Bye bye.
Jason Hamrock: Bye.
Jason Hamrock: Well, Jeremy, thank you, thank you, thank you, we learned a lot. And I think a couple of takeaways for us to learn, church, would be. Number one, we’re not going to accidentally just fall back into the way we used to do church. I think we need to be very intentional about engaging the people that go to our church, to get them back into church. One of the best ways to do that would be to have some kind of an event where it’s serving the community, or serving people from another part of the world, like Compass is doing. To get everybody back together, and to serve, practice community, and I think that’s really important that we are intentional about that. Not only that, I think we need to communicate and advertise and promote that, not only within our congregation, but outside our congregation.
Jason Hamrock: Another couple of ideas that come to my mind that I’ve seen other churches do is, you know, one time a month they’re doing like a family day on campus after the Sunday service. Where they’re getting together, and they’re maybe it’s a kids thing, they’re going to have bounce houses, or maybe it’s like a barbecue they’re going to do, or some live worship and just kind of hang out together. So come to church on that Sunday, and then stay for some community afterward. And not only do we need to think about those things, we need to promote it.
Jason Hamrock: I know that this coming Christmas season at Missional Marketing, we’re intentional about helping you understand that now this year in particular, you have to advertise to your own congregation to get them off the couch, so to speak, and get them dressed up and get the kids ready and come to church. And one of the ways you can do that, obviously, was Christmas. With Christmas Eve fast approaching, it seems like it’s a long way away, but it’ll be here before we know it. One way to do that is to invite your own congregation, as well as people outside your church walls. And I think you’ve got to be intentional about having those events.
Jason Hamrock: I think a fall festival is a great opportunity. It’s very likely that a local government, or a city, or town, they’re going to shut down Halloween, perhaps. So these kids need to have an outlet to go trick or treating, so do a fall festival, trunk or treat type of thing in your parking lot, and make it fun. Parents will love that. And promote and advertise that to your people, and people around you in your community.
Jason Hamrock: When it comes to Thanksgiving, maybe it’s a way to serve other families, right? So have a drive, where you’re going to come together and bring food to bless other people. Christmas in December, that’s that’s kind of easy. And then think about the New Year, there’s all kinds of things that you could be doing to bring people back together.
Jason Hamrock: I think we’ve got to be intentional about promoting things, so that we get back in the habit of doing church again. And it’s a great opportunity for your church, you can change the way you’re doing it, just like Compass is doing it. You don’t have to do the things you used to do before COVID, think of things to do in the future. And what does that look like? A great opportunity to kind of kill those sacred cows that you just don’t want to do anymore, but we just had to do them. Well, today’s a new day, you can maybe do something different.
Jason Hamrock: So I’d encourage you to think deeply about that, and then talk to us if you’re interested in having us help you promote that. We do a lot of campaigns that are on Facebook, and Instagram, and YouTube, and Google Display Network, and certainly Google search. There are so many things that we can help you with to get the word out, and get people engaged.
Jason Hamrock: And so, I’m excited about this next season of the church because Jeremy, his Pastor Drew, said that when COVID hit, the world stopped. But the church hit play, the church kept going, and the church is unstoppable, and the church is going to continue to grow, thrive. We know this, but I think we need to be intentional about that/ we can’t just accidentally get there, and so we’re here to help you if you need some help. Until next time, take care and God bless.